Where has the worst environment for automotive longevity?

"Eric @ opposite-lock.com" (theyrerolling) 01/30/2016 at 08:09 • Filed to: OPPINIONS

1

56

A recent post of mine about the SLC metro area got me thinking: There are a lot of things that can make a place bad for cars - salt (rust), freezing, wide temperature swings, heat (ruins plastics and rubber), dry (rubber), wet (leaks, electrical), etc. So, where, in your opinion, has the worst environment for automotive health and longevity?

My vote would be for the worst I experienced: SLC, UT. They salt the roads heavily in winter so cars that you didn’t realize could rust will rust (or at least bubble paint), there’s salt dust on everything year round, it freezes, the temperature extremes are very high, it destroys interiors because it gets really hot in the summer and due to altitude the sun is more intense, paint suffers from harsh sun, it’s so dry that rubbers are destroyed, the drivers are terrible, the locals don’t give a single fuck about their cars (you’ll get parking lot rash like crazy and if your car is nicer then the jealous people will beat it harder), putting a car in a garage in the winter sometimes makes rust worse because it melts so often exposing bare metal, there are a lot of unpaved/gravel roads, etc. It’s like a third world country with nicer cars and a harsher climate.

I’m pretty sure there are other cities/states that are worse in some respects, but don’t know of any in a first world country that combine so many bad aspects together into one.

So, where do you believe is worst on cars and why? If you want, break it down into first and third world, because I know some third world countries have a pretty rough environment...

crowmolly > Eric @ opposite-lock.com 01/30/2016 at 08:20

7

Any of the great lakes states.

Eric @ opposite-lock.com > crowmolly 01/30/2016 at 08:29

0

Elaborate

Needmoargarage > crowmolly 01/30/2016 at 08:31

3

So...salting in SLC is a joke compared to the Great Lakes Region (specifically MI). I’ve lived in both and am amazed at how rust free cars in Utah are.

I’m originally from central CA which is generally regarded as one of the best places due to dry conditions. However, the unrelenting sun is incredibly harsh on clear coat, tires, and trim pieces. A car’s body might last forever, but everything else looks beat.

And if you want to talk third world, it is really rough. At least in Central America many cars are battered by constant collisions with buses and microbuses, there are few decent shops, you can’t really get parts as everything is imported, nobody obeys the few traffic laws in place, etc.

Short-throw Granny Shifter is 2 #blessed 2b stressed > crowmolly 01/30/2016 at 08:33

3

Agreed. I spent a long time in Illinois and Indiana, and it’s pretty much a given any car over 10 years old or so has rust around the fenders and wheel wells. It’s that brine shit they use on roads now. It turns into such a fine dust and gets kicked up everywhere.

Some cars, the Mazda protégé and GMC Sierra come to mind, never even stood a chance.

vondon302 > Eric @ opposite-lock.com 01/30/2016 at 08:38

1

Yup michigan has to be up there. Heavily salted in winter hot in summer and roads are crap. Just spent last night cutting up an a arm on a 2006 cobalt cause the mounting bolt had fused to the bushing.

Mercedes Streeter > Eric @ opposite-lock.com 01/30/2016 at 08:38

2

Illinois and Wisconsin (I live in both, so I’m targeting both). Cars with poor rust protection will start rusting before their warranty ends (see: Last gen Mazdas). For all other cars, 7 years of temperatures ranging from -20F to 110F, rain, snow, ice, and dry heat will ultimately do the job. And if it isn’t the body that that dies, the engine and the rest of the mechanical parts will.

Around here, it’s also commonplace to have a car with perfect, rust-free body...but sitting on a frame of Swiss cheese.

Jdrentarol > Eric @ opposite-lock.com 01/30/2016 at 08:39

0

Kansas- blisteringly hot summers, freeze-your-penis-off winters.

davedave1111 > Eric @ opposite-lock.com 01/30/2016 at 08:44

1

The biggest factors aren’t climate related, really: they’re the strictness of regulations in regard to what’s allowed on the road, and the cost of labour. Somewhere labour’s cheap and regulations are loose, cars will go on forever despite terrible conditions; somewhere with restrictive regulation and expensive labour, even minor issues are enough to send a car to a scrappy after a certain point - I’ve had a car that was beyond economical repair because it needed a CV joint gaiter, for example, whereas elsewhere...

crowmolly > Eric @ opposite-lock.com 01/30/2016 at 08:47

2

Sure.

The corrosion up there is really like nowhere else. I’ve seen trucks that were less than 4 years old with rust holes in their rocker panels.

Bad enough to rust frames, brake lines, electrical connections, grounding straps, etc.

It gets somewhat hot during the summer but it can get real cold during the winter. So cold starts are common. Starting a diesel can be a PITA.

Just brutal. I bought a project car that was originally from there. Don’t ever do that.

dailydoseofmindlessness > Eric @ opposite-lock.com 01/30/2016 at 09:01

0

Most of the tropics, atrocious heat and humidity.

Sam > Eric @ opposite-lock.com 01/30/2016 at 09:09

1

Upper Midwest. They salt, but the weather can be unpredictable enough that it rains a few days after the snow. Rain + salt = rust much faster than snow + salt.

Master Cylinder > crowmolly 01/30/2016 at 09:24

1

I live in Michigan and can verify that all of this is true.

If you want your car to survive, you need to rinse it frequently throughout the winter and wash it when it gets above freezing. I spray a preservative wax on the underside every fall as well.

But yeah, it’s a little surreal seeing cars and trucks that are only a few years old with rusty fenders. Ram pickups seem to be the hardest hit. Dunno why exactly.

Alfalfa > Eric @ opposite-lock.com 01/30/2016 at 09:29

0

SLC has nothing on Great Lakes states. It’s really not terrible here. Not great, but not terrible. You really just need to be careful if your specific car has a propensity to rust. Maybe it was different at some point, but I’ve liked under many a used car, most around 20 years old, and mainly rust free.

banjo cat ghost of oppo past > Eric @ opposite-lock.com 01/30/2016 at 09:45

0

I can add to this. Just below the great lakes are the fingerlakes. Ancient seabeds below them created some of the largest salt mines on the east coast, mined by one of the largest family companies in the US, Cargill. As in 2 million tons of road salt shipped to more than 1500 locations throughout the northeast United States each year. They do a damn thing to it first just dig the dirty ass salt out and plaster the whole winter with it.

In highschool I rowed by this factory almost every day, just a 15 minute scenic drive up Cayuga lake from the center of Ithaca. Apparently tours are pretty neat.

So ofcourse local communities like Syracuse, Ithaca, Watkins Glen, Buffalo and so on get absolutely dicked by state road maintinence crews to dozens of small plowing businesses that pop up during the winter using poorly maintained spreaders. They constantly spill salt when they’re not supposed to, leaving piles at every intersection or just caking you car in a culinary depth of salt crust if you’re unfortunate enough to get stuck behind one.

You car’s rocker panels and exhaust will rust within 4 years if you do not wash it regularly. In college I had the family car and worked at the local ski resort. In two years of diving 30 minutes to work had the bottom half of the doors completely corrode as well as most of my exhaust.

N3O9Pr > davedave1111 01/30/2016 at 09:58

1

This. Rhode Island fits this. Horrible roadway condition. Terrible salting. Poor winter weather management. Everyone drives like their pants are on fire... But even if you are fine with fixing the mechanicals they’ll fail you for panel rot.

Forced to scrap a Bronco, unjustifiably, for contained fender rot. Watched a bumper rot off (O-F-F) a brand new urban-cruiser ‘Burban in less than 4 years.

Patrick Nichols > Eric @ opposite-lock.com 01/30/2016 at 10:13

1

I'd probably say Dresden between 1939 and 1944

Patrick Nichols > Patrick Nichols 01/30/2016 at 10:15

0

Picture for reference

PowderHound > Eric @ opposite-lock.com 01/30/2016 at 10:18

1

Western New York. Not sure if it's because everyone is relatively poor so there are more rusty cars out there or what. Definitely see more cars about to rust right through than the salt lake area

Jack Does Cars > Eric @ opposite-lock.com 01/30/2016 at 10:26

2

I’m currently in Ohio, and I’d have to say that. It is impossible to find an American car older than 10 years old that hasn’t been destroyed by rust.

WilliamsSW > crowmolly 01/30/2016 at 10:31

1

I'd add potholes to the list of Great Lakes area hazards, too - - when the roads start to thaw in February/March, they can damage suspensions, as well as blow tires and dent rims.

Rainbow > Eric @ opposite-lock.com 01/30/2016 at 10:41

1

I don’t know, but the Bible Belt area is the best. My neighbor’s van has had most of the paint missing from its hood for the past 5 years or so, and there’s not a single spot of rust there.

Pokesmot > banjo cat ghost of oppo past 01/30/2016 at 10:55

0

A rower... Thought I was alone. Sweep or scull?

Pokesmot > banjo cat ghost of oppo past 01/30/2016 at 10:58

0

You must have a lot of upper body strength, from rowing;)

 > Eric @ opposite-lock.com 01/30/2016 at 10:58

1

NY, Ontario, Quebec. Just about anywhere it snows and they dump gobs of salt on the road along with beetjuice cocktail. Eats up the bodies in no time at all.

Eric @ opposite-lock.com > Needmoargarage 01/30/2016 at 11:02

0

Yeah, the third world is hard on cars. That’s why I thought it was hard to compare. In some places cars just get battered by a constant barrage of accidents making them really rough looking pretty quickly.

How do the Great Lakes region cities get so much salt? SLC gets it right from the lake and it returns to the lake. In the few I’ve been to up there, none have the dead lawns and constantly grey powder everywhere like they do in SLC.

On the other hand, better corrosion resistance on modern cars combined with the relative dryness of the environment probably keeps rust down a bit more. It used to be worse because cars weren't rustproof ef well enough.

Eric @ opposite-lock.com > Mercedes Streeter 01/30/2016 at 11:05

0

The last is also true of SLC. Technically all of it is. But they also have a safety testing regime that takes cars off the road so they have an unusually-young fleet there.

The extremes of temperature make me think it could be worse. Plus I think there is more rain and humidity, which would worsen corrosion.

I honestly imagined it would be more northeast that was voted worst. Like NY or PA.

Needmoargarage > WilliamsSW 01/30/2016 at 11:15

1

Dealing with this now /:

Eric @ opposite-lock.com > banjo cat ghost of oppo past 01/30/2016 at 11:20

0

Most of this sounds like my favorite from out west, but they scrape it off massive drying ponds instead of mining it. The temperature extremes are greater where you are and the humidity is high except when frozen, which I'm sure makes it worse.

Needmoargarage > Eric @ opposite-lock.com 01/30/2016 at 11:22

0

So to put it in some perspective, the last I heard, Utah spends around 5 million a year on salt. They also use a brine solution to cut down on costs and reduce environmental impact, damage to roads and cars, etc.

Michigan budgets nearly 100 million for salt most years. The state of cars is direct evidence of the high concentration. In Utah, you might see a few cars with some rust. Out here, no rust is the exception and you can literally see driver’s legs through the rust in some cars.

Caleb "If a rally car can do it, so can my Malibu" M. S. > Eric @ opposite-lock.com 01/30/2016 at 11:23

0

Iowa is pretty bad. Year round temperatures range from 110 to -25 (that’s our range over the last 365 days), we salt the living crap out of our roads in the winter, and in the summer its wickedly dry.

If only EssExTee could be so grossly incandescent > Eric @ opposite-lock.com 01/30/2016 at 11:24

2

Coastal New England. Salt air year-round, and longer winters mean more exposure to road salt. Wet snow means salty slush splashing up into the undercarriage. Summers are still hot and weather is unpredictable. Extreme humidity hastens corrosion.

And, at least in MA, stricter state inspections remove a lot of cars from the road well before their useful life is up.

WilliamsSW > Needmoargarage 01/30/2016 at 11:30

0

Ugh - sorry to hear it. Have dealt with it in the past, but thankfully, not recently. The $ and parts can add up quickly if it's bad.

Needmoargarage > WilliamsSW 01/30/2016 at 11:36

1

Haha yup. Especially if you decide to upgrade while you’re at it!

That’s really where this began.

911e46z06 > Eric @ opposite-lock.com 01/30/2016 at 11:41

0

WilliamsSW > Needmoargarage 01/30/2016 at 11:47

0

Well then, at least you’re getting some benefit from the $ you're spending! Love that look, too - I think it looks great with the color of the car.

Eric @ opposite-lock.com > davedave1111 01/30/2016 at 12:04

1

This is another good point. The reason some places have so few destroyed cars on the road is a combination of affluence and safety/smog checks. Where I live now we have some of the weirdest cars on the road because they don’t die very quickly and there are neither smog nor safety checks, so anything that doesn’t attract too much police attention can stay on the road. Basically, if you have a muffler and noting is falling off, you can keep driving it.

Needmoargarage > WilliamsSW 01/30/2016 at 12:06

0

Thanks! The pothole incident did help give my upgrade to new wheels and tires some basis when presenting to the wife haha.

Eric @ opposite-lock.com > Needmoargarage 01/30/2016 at 12:08

0

They don’t have to spend much because it doesn’t need to be mined/delivered. Plus that’s one city. The valley has numerous cities that use it.

On the other hand, it doesn’t snow much, so they don’t put it down as constantly as they do in other places.

davedave1111 > Eric @ opposite-lock.com 01/30/2016 at 12:17

1

Yeah, here we’ve got pretty tough standards - so cars that fail MOT and aren’t worth repairing get shipped off to some other country with laxer standards.

http://www.motuk.co.uk/manual/content…

Eric @ opposite-lock.com > If only EssExTee could be so grossly incandescent 01/30/2016 at 12:19

0

I actually have suspected that this was the worst environment. Somewhere coastal in New England where they salt a lot, nobody really cares about cars (NYC & Boston come to mind), and they do safety checks that take cars off the road (like SLC, but they benefit from being close to places with surplus rust free cars).

The only odd thing is that I'm surrounded by the Puget Sound on all sides and cars don't get rusty from it. I don't know why it is so different from the east coast. In CA the only places that suffer rust are right on the coast where cars get a continual salt spray.

banjo cat ghost of oppo past > Pokesmot 01/30/2016 at 12:42

0

Eh both. 7 Seat in an 8 through most of it but I got my state championships in a quad

Needmoargarage > Eric @ opposite-lock.com 01/30/2016 at 13:44

0

Good point. I think the shipping it would cost next to nothing if they do process the salt locally. I think the numbers I quoted are state budgets, but yeah I’m sure they need far less in Utah due to the relative dryness and lower threat of icy roads.

All I really know is that Utah roads are awesome, cars are in much better shape, and drivers form some mad slow rolling roadblocks. The car related upside to moving to Michigan was racetracks and rally driving.

Spoon II > Eric @ opposite-lock.com 01/30/2016 at 14:00

0

The East Coast of Newfoundland. Salty sea air, heavily salted roads, endless snow...then rain...then snow...then mist, and massive potholes. Lovely place for anything that doesn’t rust, such as people.

gmctavish needs more space > Eric @ opposite-lock.com 01/30/2016 at 14:17

0

I feel like Ontario is pretty terrible, when I was there I hardly saw anything more than 10 years old, and anything more than a couple years old was starting to rust. Coming from the west coast where our biggest problem for cars is humidity and rain, I didn't realize so many new vehicles were capable of rusting that badly.

JR1 > Jack Does Cars 01/30/2016 at 15:39

0

One of the worst things about leaving here in Ohio

Captain of the Enterprise > Eric @ opposite-lock.com 01/30/2016 at 15:41

0

Michigan

Hot summer

Cold winter with lots of salt

Terrible roads wearing down cars quicker

Jack Does Cars > JR1 01/30/2016 at 16:39

0

Miraculously, my grandfather owns four American cars built before 2002 and NONE of them have rust. (‘92 Chevrolet 1500 single cab 305 4x4 manual, ‘98 V6 Mustang cconvertible manual, ‘99 Jeep Wrangler, ‘02 Tahoe)

JR1 > Jack Does Cars 01/30/2016 at 17:52

0

That's impressive

Jack Does Cars > JR1 01/30/2016 at 18:51

0

Well he is insanely OCD, and takes meticulous care of his vehicles.

Case A, the red Wrangler:

TheOnelectronic > Eric @ opposite-lock.com 02/01/2016 at 06:49

0

I recently moved from New Mexico to Pennsylvania. It’s amazing the difference in the number of rusted out shit-buckets. The combination of the mummifying aridity and lack of any sort of state inspection meant there were a lot of cars on the road that really should not have been. Usually doing about 30 on the 80-85mph interstate.

Then I get here and I haven’t seen a true junker in quite some time. It’s almost sad.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Master Cylinder 02/16/2016 at 13:31

0

What’s preservative wax?

Master Cylinder > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 02/16/2016 at 15:42

1

It’s just a corrosion-proofing spray, I spray it on brake/fuel lines, exposed hardware, and such. Not sure if it’s actually wax, but it’s just a sealant to keep the moisture/salt off. It’s pretty durable, survives all winter through washing as often as I can with those coin-op pressure washer car washes.

There are multiple brands, the kind I use is made by CRC. Heavy-Duty Corrosion Inhibitor or something like that.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Master Cylinder 02/16/2016 at 15:56

0

So that’s how your 944 survives MI winters!! ;)

I’ll need to look this stuff up. I’m planning on doing my underbody up with POR-15 when the weather warms up.

Master Cylinder > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 02/16/2016 at 16:21

0

Yep! The factory did a great job with galvanizing and undercoating the body, but thr fasteners and other fittings are still somewhat vulnerable. I have a few spots where the undercoat is damaged that I need to repair but as long as the galvanization isn’t damaged, it’s not a huge deal. I haven’t discovered anything worse than very minor surface rust in my car, and I’ve yet to break any fasteners (knock on wood).

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Master Cylinder 02/16/2016 at 16:27

0

I have a spot where the undercoat is damaged with no signs of rust, but the rockers....I’m not taking any chances with those. Especially since one of them is cracking with what I can only assume is Bondo. If water has been getting in there....I don’t want to imagine what it could look like. So I’m gonna get that done when the tax refund check arrives.

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > Eric @ opposite-lock.com 03/14/2016 at 20:38

0

At some point, it’s bad on the owner of t00-nice cars who want to actually drive them. If you’re not Jay Leno with unlimited air conditioned parking, then drive something that isn’t sensitive to parking lot rash.